Forum Index Shadow [3.7] Essence Drain/Contagion Trickster (the best one)

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0sync0 wrote:
I've seen people say it is better to use Bane for leveling instead of ED/Contagion. Any advice on when to switch from Bane to ED/Contagion?


You can easily use both. I've level to 70 easily with four link bane in a deodre's scorn helm, and a four link ED and contagian. Usually hit bane first to curse with despair and then for large groups/legion mobs ED/Cont

stephenp1983
Jun 15, 2019 18:53:26 PM

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stephenp1983 wrote:
You can easily use both.

OK. But I get the impression ED/Contagion is not effective to use until you reach a certain point. I don't know what that point is though.

0sync0
Jun 15, 2019 21:34:24 PM

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0sync0 wrote:
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stephenp1983 wrote:
You can easily use both.

OK. But I get the impression ED/Contagion is not effective to use until you reach a certain point. I don't know what that point is though.

I levelled with Blight, then switched to ED/Con as soon as I was able (mostly because I'm an eejit, and forgot Bane existed, but I digress). I wouldn't say it's not "effective," per se, but it definitely wasn't the most "efficient" way to go about it. It still killed fairly quickly in my experience, with Blight being required to help shave off HP in rares and bosses.

Of course, come Increased Area of Effect Support and Intensify Support, the trash was getting cleared like no-one's business. So, if I had to guess at a best point to transition from Bane to ED/Con, it'd be at levels 31 and 38 when you can use those supports.

Dragei
Jun 16, 2019 02:51:20 AM

Why exactly do we use bows instead of dual wielded statstick wands or something? Does the gem level on this and supports just scale it that insanely that it outdoes anything we could do with caster gear?

heishe
Jun 16, 2019 04:37:02 AM

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heishe wrote:
Why exactly do we use bows instead of dual wielded statstick wands or something? Does the gem level on this and supports just scale it that insanely that it outdoes anything we could do with caster gear?


ED doesnt scale wjth crit etc. Best way to scale ED is wjth gem lvl, similar to skills like herald of agony, vortex etc.

To put things in perspective:

Lvl 20 ED deals 1503.2 dot
Lvl 21 ED deals 1683.9 dot
Lvl 23 ED (21 ed + lvl 3 empower) deals 2109.6 dot
Lvl 24 ED (21 ED + lvl 4 empower) deals 2359.2 dot ==> best case for chest armors, pending corruptions
Lvl 25 ED (21 ed, lvl 3 empower, +1 bow) deals 2637 dot

Lvl 27 ED (21 ED, lvl 3 empower, +1 bow, +2 supp gems) deals 3289.8
Lvl 28 ED (21 ED, lvl 4 empower, +1 bow, +2 supp) deals 3672 dot ==> "cheap" multimodded bow

TLDR, Bow deals approximately 50% MORE DAMAGE.

dejuvenate
Jun 16, 2019 06:38:38 AM

"
0sync0 wrote:
I've seen people say it is better to use Bane for leveling instead of ED/Contagion. Any advice on when to switch from Bane to ED/Contagion?



"
0sync0 wrote:
"
stephenp1983 wrote:
You can easily use both.

OK. But I get the impression ED/Contagion is not effective to use until you reach a certain point. I don't know what that point is though.


1-go blight

Once you have frost bomb complement blight with frost bomb on tougher mobs. Blight on tougher enemies.

12 - ed then blight on tougher mobs. Contagion ed on packs

At 24 you can use bane. This is smoother for now in my experience.

At 31 get jntensify. Keep using bane.

At 38 get inc aoe. Link contagion with intensify and inc aoe. You can now become a demigod.

Basically ed contagion is useable once you get ed at 12. But bane is probably faster and better in low density mobs in a3-a4 until you get both inc aoe and intensify.

dejuvenate
Jun 16, 2019 06:42:41 AM

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rlauren2 wrote:
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bankai1009 wrote:
Great guide, loved your last one too for winterorb :)

What are your thoughts on the 'best' setup for hard bosses like uber elder for:
1) Evasion defensive by using Hyrri Ire and getting 10% more spell and attack dodge instead of MoM?
2) Wither totem vs Blight totem vs Self-Cast Blight setup?

Also for immortal call and steelskin, do you have that on a CWDT setup?


"
jinhaoxuan wrote:
what i'm worried about is one shot from T16 legion mobs. with MoM sometimes i still get one shotted. how do you think about the survivability without MoM?


Grouping these since they're both mostly about survivability.

I don't like Hyrri. Between evasion, acro, blind aura, quartz flask, atziri's step, escape artist, jade flask, vaal grace, etc. you already have an insane amount of avoidance mechanics. You'll often be over-capped on dodge. As a Shadow, avoidance is your main tool by design. The playstyle of this build is 1) move out of the way of telegraphed attacks, 2) cast spells when it's safe, 3) move out of the way again. The long duration of ED plays nicely into this. Legion's rework of Immortal Call also makes "active" defense more valuable and punishes "passive" defense. I personally don't know the mechanics of the super end game bosses too well, so I plan on putting my defensive skill on a much higher leveled CWDT so it will only trigger when I'm taking a beating. Not sure how exactly that will end up. For a more experienced player, self-casting will reward that higher skill cap.

The problem with avoidance as a defense mechanic is that, while lowering your probability of getting one-shot from 100% to maybe 5%, you're still gonna die eventually. We have *some* mitigation in the form of ghost shrouds and IC/Steelskin, but not much. The only defense is HP. For a pure defensive setup, Perfect Form plus Essence Worm/MoM is the best option. With PF, I would drop acro from the tree entirely, use those 8 points to stack more ES or mana with things like Void Barrier, Unnatural Calm, Arcane Focus, Deep Thoughts, etc. Without the 30% ES penalty from acro, it shouldn't be a stretch to get 5-6k life, 3k ES, and 1-1.5k unreserved mana. That's a pretty massive eHP pool for a build that also has an insane amount of avoidance mechanics. As far as how much you can deviate from this and still be OK, it depends on too many factors (your character level, your skill, your gear, your tolerance level for death frequency, etc.). You kind of have to just feel it out.

As for Wither/Blight, self-cast blight is the most offensive since you can trigger the infusion buff and add more damage support gems. Blight totems are the middle ground, still doing some damage. Wither totems are the most defensive, since they don't do any damage now, but you get to free up a gem slot by not using Spreading Rot. Right now I'm self-casting, but I haven't reached high red maps, so we'll see how it goes.


This is the kind of quality post I have come to expect from you rlauren2. Enjoyed your worb guide last league, and I have also rerolled into ED this league. After an unsuccessful trial of obligatory slayer cyclone lol.

So many ways to build this. And i got confused between pure life, mom eb, hybrid, and CI. And your post cleared this up very well. Thank you buddy!

dejuvenate
Jun 16, 2019 06:50:23 AM

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dejuvenate wrote:
"
heishe wrote:
Why exactly do we use bows instead of dual wielded statstick wands or something? Does the gem level on this and supports just scale it that insanely that it outdoes anything we could do with caster gear?


ED doesnt scale wjth crit etc. Best way to scale ED is wjth gem lvl, similar to skills like herald of agony, vortex etc.

To put things in perspective:

Lvl 20 ED deals 1503.2 dot
Lvl 21 ED deals 1683.9 dot
Lvl 23 ED (21 ed + lvl 3 empower) deals 2109.6 dot
Lvl 24 ED (21 ED + lvl 4 empower) deals 2359.2 dot ==> best case for chest armors, pending corruptions
Lvl 25 ED (21 ed, lvl 3 empower, +1 bow) deals 2637 dot

Lvl 27 ED (21 ED, lvl 3 empower, +1 bow, +2 supp gems) deals 3289.8
Lvl 28 ED (21 ED, lvl 4 empower, +1 bow, +2 supp) deals 3672 dot ==> "cheap" multimodded bow

TLDR, Bow deals approximately 50% MORE DAMAGE.


That's pretty sick. Thanks for the rundown.

heishe
Jun 16, 2019 07:22:18 AM

Planning to run this build soon but I just wanted to say you can guarantee the +1 socketed gems on a bow for about 1 ex 30C if you don't want to take the gamble.

Start with your 6 link bow white and craft any mod from the crafting bench on it. Regal it and remove the mod to leave you with a 1 mod rare. Annul off that mod so you have a 0 mod rare.

Then craft cannot roll attack mods for 1 ex. You then use the beastcraft that removes a suffix and adds a prefix and boom. You have your +1 bow ready to multimod with no rng.

Sphiralis
Jun 16, 2019 10:21:07 AM

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Sphiralis wrote:
Planning to run this build soon but I just wanted to say you can guarantee the +1 socketed gems on a bow for about 1 ex 30C if you don't want to take the gamble.

Start with your 6 link bow white and craft any mod from the crafting bench on it. Regal it and remove the mod to leave you with a 1 mod rare. Annul off that mod so you have a 0 mod rare.

Then craft cannot roll attack mods for 1 ex. You then use the beastcraft that removes a suffix and adds a prefix and boom. You have your +1 bow ready to multimod with no rng.


Thank you. This helps a lot with the RNG.

Whats the cost of the beastcraft? I have always alt regal annul as statistically they come up to be less than 1ex unless I got really unlucky streak.

dejuvenate
Jun 16, 2019 11:24:22 AM
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